SideFX Houdini 15 it out!

[MauricioPC]

Pretty impressive update.

http://www.sidefx.com/index.php?option= ... &Itemid=66

Full feature list:
http://www.sidefx.com/index.php?option= ... Itemid=422

http://www.sidefx.com/docs/houdini15.0/news/15/

It's already possible to download:
http://www.sidefx.com/index.php?option= ... Itemid=208

[Rez007]

That is pretty impressive, once again from SideFX!

[Bullit]

Nice, but for me did they change the paradigm to seek user friendliness or not?

[Mathaeus]

Nice, but for me did they change the paradigm to seek user friendliness or not?

Not at all. It's looking more like comeback to their traditional tasks, simulation and so on. From what I've tried in last few hours, FEM cloth is significantly faster, but still few times slower than my single threaded Syflex in XSI 7.01. Of course there are improvements all around, but.....
... when it comes to characters and animation, some new things, like ability to provide object as an up vector for direction constraint, that might be competitive to Softimage 3d (maybe), not any XSI. For info, H actually (still) don't have a real constraints (operator, can blend to self, not object with own SRT). Instead there's sort of parenting described by objects/nodes, which effectively kills the functionality we already know in SI or Maya - while potential advantages are unknown. This synoptic-like thing actually existed in H13, it was broken in 14, now is just enabled again.
... when it comes to nodal, ICE style visual programming, H support for arrays is still joke, it can't perform even basic math (add, multiply) directly on array. Loops and loops and loops, instead. H15 is finally able to use nodes to read envelope attributes (feature of ICE in XSI 7).
And so on... all that filled with expressions everywhere (with own, different syntax).
As usually there are nice things around Mantra, as long as CPU path tracer is attractive in GPU times.
Anyway, personally fill relaxed, really. Worst scenario could be a their real, but half done trial to make an app usable for everyday work of small players, forcing me to masochistic work of building the usable superstructure - let's say to add a system of real constraints, but still to keep all that expressions all around. As it is for now, I think I'll still experimenting with it from time to time, slowly but surely moving on. On their side, according to updates, crowd system seems to be successful. So, at least in my case, it's divorce where everyone is happy.
Hope I'll write more in next few days...

[Werner]

Why don't you move to Maya already Mathaeus? Why waist your time if Houdini is not impressing you?

I think it is an incredible release, and I've been using it through the beta phase for modeling right through to rendering. They (SESI) did a lot of work over the last 9 months.
Looking at SP2 from Autodesk, makes me happy that we decided to invest else where.

Look, there are still some parts that needs attention. Over the last week we rigged characters and it was great. Skinning needs work, but they are on it...we will have to wait and see what they come up with. Viewport speed improvements is mind blowing and I think it leaves maya in the dust. Animating multiple characters in the same scene is fast...just duplicate the simple rigs and see for your self.

It will be hard for us to leave the non-destructive workflow behind, and no other application does it like Houdini.

[Mathaeus]

Why don't you move to Maya already Mathaeus?

No need to go with personal decisions, there, what is coming, it is coming, with or without us. By the way H is not only 3d I've learn in last time, let's say it was fifty fifty in my case. Anyway I think H still has a chance for survival, as this software always, always served as ''best companion'' to Maya, never ever even trying to compete in 1:1 ratio, as our bellowed 3d did. That's entire secret, imho.

[SamHowell]

I've only played with H15 for an hour or so. My first impression is SPEED.

Everything feels more responsive from the the viewport to general navigation. There is a very noticeable improvement in Mantra performance. The new Principle Shader is a joy to use (and quite un-Houdini like in it's approach). Particles and Flip are a lot faster.

It's more of a .5 release but that's more than enough for 9 months work.

Still waiting to be impressed by any Bi-Frost development.....

[Mathaeus]

Regarding speed, and what I had chance to try tonight - VOP (that is, ''ICE") execution was a bit slower, perhaps because I used default viewport settings in H 15. As usually, 3d app is stable, except usual crashes when closing the old scene and opening new one in one go - not big problem as I already have ctrl+S-from-time-to-time habits. Some new VOP nodes are present, anyway don't see anything significant.

[SamHowell]

Regarding speed, and what I had chance to try tonight - VOP (that is, ''ICE") execution was a bit slower

By execution, do you mean the Vex nodes Cook Time?

[MauricioPC]

We can always play the game of catching up. Maya 2016 was praised for great modeling tools, most of them available in 3ds Max for what? 4 or 5 years? BiFrost looks like it has a LOT of potential, but it's not there.

I like what SideFX is doing with Houdini. They are improving on what they do best (FX work) and they are addressing problems in other areas. Sure, it'll take some time, but they'll get there. I think it shows why H have been growing and growing, dominating the FX work in studios. Nobody uses Maya for FX anymore (aside from Weta, and that is probably have custom). I wonder how long it'll take for BiFrost to get to the level of Houdini. From what I understand, that level of simulation (1 billion particles) is only a dream to run on BiFrost or even Maya.

Personally, I'm love seeing H kicks ass on the FX field. Specially being a Max user and seeing how arrogant Cebas (makers of TP) are. They always like to say that they are the best FX software out there. Well, think again.

[Mathaeus]

Regarding speed, and what I had chance to try tonight - VOP (that is, ''ICE") execution was a bit slower

By execution, do you mean the Vex nodes Cook Time?

Execution of already compiled nodes, which do not need to be compiled again in new frame. Used for deforming the mesh. Did some basic tests in another system, performs so much better - anyway better to do not talk in advance.

[Bullit]

Why don't you move to Maya already Mathaeus? Why waist your time if Houdini is not impressing you?

No need for that.
Mathaeus supported his opinion with facts. Now if anyone can shot his facts go on.

FEM cloth is significantly faster, but still few times slower than my single threaded Syflex in XSI 7.01.

For info, H actually (still) don't have a real constraints (operator, can blend to self, not object with own SRT).

when it comes to nodal, ICE style visual programming, H support for arrays is still joke, it can't perform even basic math (add, multiply) directly on array. Loops and loops and loops, instead.

There is a crowd of cheerleaders for Houdini some due to hate Autodesk build for themselves. SESI have much commendable things and the evolution seems going in positive direction but lets not whitewash the usability problems it has.

[SamHowell]

I use Houdini as there is simply no alternative to ICE that comes anywhere close. It's as simple as that. Usability doesn't come into it. This will change in time but I'm not prepared to wait. I am not anti Autodesk (they are just a company making money), but I simply do not believe them when they say bifrost will be a replacement for ICE and will be available for release in the next few versions of Maya.

[Werner]

Not at all. It really was a question more than me trying to shot Mathaeus down. For me it was the other way around. I hated every minute I spent in Maya, and decided to drop it.

For me it's about time. Why spend time on something you don't like, where the time could be spent on learning something you love. Very much the same as sticking it out with Softimage at this stage. It does not make sense. Sure, you can get the job done faster and with great workflow, but as time goes by, you will need to consider learning something else anyway.
Windows updates and drivers is something to consider here. We are already experiencing strange behavior in Soft that we never had before.

Also I think that my approach might be different than some others here. I really don't want to change Houdini to work like Softimage. Some things are great, and other areas suck, but I'm treating Houdini like any other 3d application I've used during my career. Luckely we don't get too overly technical like other studios that needs lots of developers during our productions. Houdini takes care of that...like ICE did. This varies from studio to studio, but what I found was that non destructive workflow was the single most important aspect of influence when we made our choice. Here Houdini takes the lead...even above Softimage.
We do character animation for tv commercials and every now and then we get some vfx work for film (nothing Hollywood style though). Our clients like to change their mind more in a day than what I can try to remember.
I found Houdini to be fairly good in this area during the H15beta phase, and love the rigging tools and viewport speed that it gives us. Our animators(most with a Maya training that moved over to Soft) love the animation editor. We submit requests every now and then, and lots of them made it into this release.

Blender is another tool that we are looking into. It is growing on us and it will be part of our pipeline. Strange to learn, but I enjoy it way more than Maya.

All to their own I guess. I don't hate Maya because it is a Autodesk product. I just felt like leaving the industry every time I opened the application. Nothing more to ad there.

Sorry if I sounded like a jerk Mathaeus. I always have and always will value your opinion.

[NNois]

I really like what i saw on this release.

The principle shader and the layered material is genius if i understand right. There is no more extra render time using a second specular lobe for example, because all computations appears after the mixing. Am i right ?

[MauricioPC]

We do character animation for tv commercials and every now and then we get some vfx work for film (nothing Hollywood style though).

Hey Werner,

Would you mind sharing your reel or website? I'm curious to see the work done with Houdini on Character Animation!

Question: You guys still have Softimage, but on modeling, are you guys planning on doing it in Houdini or Blender is being added for that?

I know Blender is improving a lot on animation. And while I still like 3ds Max, I'm considering options to not be dependent on Autodesk and Cebas.