Softimage Dreams

[FXDude]

____________________________________________
---------- SOFTIMAGE DREAMS (0.8)
____________________________________________

I guess this is in response various more-or-less recent SI|Happenings..


First, I wasn't quite fond of the XSI Base news, since I think that "the community"
is one of SI's (and the community itself)'s main strengths,
and it almost feels like it's been "under attack"

(EDIT: See first footnote)
One of the first things Autodesk, did was replace the former community page
"community.softimage.com" with a new Area SI forum.. being totally fine I guess..

but while essentially purging all content (all ~4000 Topic /~30,000 post worth)
which wasn't any less of a loss of knowledge base..

.. and redirecting any links to the former community page, NOT to the new forum,
but to a single generic page FULL of anything -but- SI related content,
poping-up whenever clicking on any of the large number of links everywhere pointing to the old forum.

(EDIT: Plus generic page showing up-on-top by googling "Softimage Community" still today!)


And now, the main historic XSI channel gave way to it's final (of multiple) cyber attack(s) from who knows..

Googling "XSI Base" has had "Malware" as it's top search suggestions for a while (for instance)
& Clicking on any links to it would show a Google warning page,
with a "dead" (un-hotlinked yet copyable) address to the requested page

so I can't say it comes to a big suprise...
(E: which also makes-it's closure not ALL necessarily such a bad thing,
. . . due those very much unfortunate circumstances.. but..)


____________

But in the Larger scheme of things concerning SI in the "marketplace"..

While considering that "the best" app, mostly has to do with what we are use to..
and that every package has it's own share of strengths and weaknesses,


I think that it can still objectively be said, ..
or don't think I'm being biased by saying that on many fronts, (yet overall*),..

.. that (x)SI, to this day, remains one of the (not to say -THE-*) *(in many contexts)
most versatile and complete "Digital Content Creation" thing out there.


This was also the case, even when the current leading leader
(E: despite many strong and several unique capabilities and features)
.. was also leading at a time when : ..

.. it had a windows 95 look and feel,
.. had a questionably descent renderer,
.. required to save separate scenes for each pass,
and to practically work blind with shader network connections (up-til this very latest version)
(all while sporting Big-Movie, Big-Studio full-page magazine screenshots ), ..


And even if.. since that time, most of (x)SI's bullet-point features has been matched at least on paper (hugely publicized paper)
(many of which developed to quite workable states to be fair, and without imploring it's overall outlook to soo "bad")

.. but Maya is still somewhat often rather unstable
and is still in a several areas, sometimes awkward, sometimes inconsistent
& often unnecessarily over-complicated as it also has in the past.

AND I won't touch upon *viewport update performance*, particularly as scenes get heavier.


Needless to say, all major apps may very well be the right choice for different projects..

yet I don't think that I'm the only one who thinks that (x)SI absolutely has an excellent core.
(& base workflow/philosophy) ... (not that it doesn't ever crash)

Enough that I'm personally still quite squirmish at the thought of switching to anything else at this point..
even if new "frost" modules would be introduced or stitched-on..
and I don't think it has all to do with just unwillingness for readaptation..
(with maybe some of that in there .. but.. )


But I think that unless something like Clarisse or FabricEngine (relatively revolutionary)
become these full-fledged 3D apps,

.. that for any (existing) complete/integrated solution,
to somewhat come closer to SI's overall versatility/workability.. (for quite few types of projects)
(E: without necessarly becoming "the same")

.. that they would basically have to rethink something new (with absolutely no guarantees).

______________

Anyone having used XSI (beyond using the "S" navigation key),
AND other solutions in the heat of production (of many types) , knows what I'm talking about,

And any studio working with SI
(while maybe more or less going against the grain, and choosing/accepting to go with a less-wide employee-base)
.. do so because they were/are able to look beyond the BIG Glitter to see what they wanted/needed,


If Maya may very well be a good choice for a number of things,
x|SI definately qualifies for -at least- as many!

Meaning.. don't get me wrong.. I'm not into pointless "which is better" discussions,
or I don't think that in the best of worlds, that SI would/should replace everything,
and of course, I'm absolutely convinced that each package can be very good in their own respects..
(I think there is place for everything.. *which is exactly my point*)

(E: And neither suggesting Autodesk to put the SI logo before 3DS's
.. n'or even getting somewhat below equal treatment)

But I also firmly believe (as others) that SI absolutely deserves more that it's getting,
in terms of *REPRESENTATION*..
(currently quite unproportional to it's actual value )

(E: Newcomers really have to look for it to a certain extent!)

And I'm disheartened to see such a thing (to certain degree) being held back ,
for mere political or privately-corporate (super-silly/self-oriented) reasons,

or because of blind mainstream heard following,
giving-in to the BIGNESS (as advertized)



Despite all that, it seems that whatever can be of SI's continued growth
has been sustained mostly from sheer user/community persistance,
"particip-action" and Mind blowing Vimeo Videos.


And I can see how/why AD would like to see it as a plugin,
(or otherwise how it can be afraid of it, probably due to at least some of the previously mentioned points..
.. while already having it's very own baby and a decent previously acquired DCC flagship
(that happened to lead the big *Show* )

Although..
buying-off every single (leading) VFX app? FOR (near-complete) market *domination* ?

FINE!!! (humm...)

But I think it would be be okay if it got over it's fear now..
(now that Autodesk owns it.. & most of everything else)...

and start seeing more as one of it's own, and LET IT HAVE (more of) A *FAIR* SHARE OF MARKET SHARE
(currently rather unfair)



That being said, since this fine place now seems to be the main place to be for all XSI related things,

Hirazi, don't know what measures can be taken to prevent such attacks that brought XSIBase to it's demise,
but maybe researching on the matter would not be a bad Idea.

Or otherwise, don't you dare slip on the sidewalk or anything.. ;)


anyway,
thanks for considering my 2c

Cheers



_________________________________________
EDIT: - Reworded the New/Former community forum section, in reaction to subsequent posts..
. . was sounding as if the former forum was replaced entirely with a generic page.

- Adjusted Highlight colors to remain legible on unlogged-in color scheme .. E2: and yet again : )


EDIT: Hoping I wasn`t too harsh on Maya, I also know Maya to be at least very good to unmatched in a number of areas..

- Particles /Particle-shading with very usable means for fluidic motion out-of-the-box + means to quickly achieve quite realistic (enough) shading,
- Populating scenes with stuff or "assets", easily making them look like just naturally there.. (PaintFx & +)
- Rigging ( ~= 2 XSI, +/- aFewThings) ,
- some aspects of the interface (while other aspects to the contrary)
- I'm sure many would add many
.. and also does get things done everyday.


3DS *Modeling* tools / modeling-*speed*(especially for particular types), measurments, fillets, chamfers, (Lots!) ... , easy intricate precision..
- positioning stuff in 3d space (click-swipe) & on surfaces ...
- WIDE array of 3rd party tools, some of which can absolutely be phenomenal .. (fume-fx, .., ...)
- VERY WIDE user/base - help, insight, comments, lots of "warmth"..
- some aspects of the interface ( while other aspects to the contrary: )
- I could go on.. & I'm sure many could add many

..

Of course --­­}> Modo!!!! ( heard lots of good things! : )

...

Edit: simplified parts

Edit: Less harshness..

..

[iamVFX]

Cool story

[iamVFX]

[rimg=1000]http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/4442/6416911c9ddb4b55b0a0ac8.png[/rimg]
[rimg=1000]http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/824/438623d830554aa59fd744e.png[/rimg]

[SreckoM]

But I also firmly believe (as others) that SI absolutely deserves more that it's getting,
in terms of *REPRESENTATION*..
(currently quite unproportional to it's actual value )

Well it is not about value but number of seats selling each year. That is only thing that matters to AD. And also that means that situation will not get any better, unfortunately. Pure math, you can even ICE it

[iamVFX]

EDIT: Double post, damn Wacom ...

You may find this useful (at least it helped me): http://viziblr.com/news/2011/8/14/the-u ... windo.html

[SreckoM]

Thanks good to know that, I already turned off some of these crap Win things!
This was typed from Mac though.

[Nizar]

I found to day this topic into 3dworld magazine forum:
http://www.3dworldmag.com/3dworld-forum ... #post14698
So sound like a common perception about softimage.
As I wrote before (2014 thread), softimage is practical desappears from any relevant magazines (3dworld, 3dcreative, 3dartists etc.), no tutorial, no news, nothing, only a few still images in a sea of 3dsm and Maya (and sometime modo) artists.
But according with AD sources, softimage market share was not so strong like to day, and London softimage user meeting was a big success (don't know if uber tage 2012 increase or not audience).
Seems like a "limbo", where is very difficult understood what is the actual softimage position, role and future.

[FXDude]

@ SreckoM

Well it is not about value but number of seats selling each year. That is only thing that matters to AD. And also that means that situation will not get any better, unfortunately. Pure math, you can even ICE it

Yep.. may not change AD's philosophy of life tomorrow (as you said entirely $ based) ..

Not that it wouldn't sell more if it was actually considered more than "a companion to Maya" but..

But since most of "the situation" of SI, or the quality of it's "continuance" also mostly relies on the community (people/us)
just as much as on AD, (SI being a mere blip on it's radar)..

.. so maybe I was futilely complaining about AD,
(finding some situations/behaviors to be s-s-so-o-o ridiculous/unnecessary)

BUT I was definitely pleading to the community!


@Nizar
Thanks for the link, & I agree it can be difficult to gage things,
but SI users tend to stick to it ( for some reason : ) which gives makes me rather confident about it's current user base,
but it's newcomers that I'd like to see more of..



I'm planning on making a site+tutorials making them as simple and to-the-point (& as fun) as possible, covering all basics for newbies.

stay tuned for that : )



@ IamVFX thanks & heres another screenshot.. : )


EDIT: Added Descriptions + other screenshots in reaction to feedback:

Landing page when following any link to the former official community address once the new forum launched,
which was surely very different when many links still pointed to it, (ED: albeit it's -current- google ranking)
but was just as generic if I recall correctly




Shots of the current product page & community forum respectively,
both of which are at the very least quite decent to be fair.

AND here is a link to a recent thread here covering those very things..
"bring back softimage.net"
viewtopic.php?f=36&t=2656



Shot of the former community page


.

[luceric]

If you're still manually typing "community.softimage.com" to get to autodesk softimage community, IMHO you deserve some of the misery you have. That's a URL from a server that was up for 6 months almost 5 years ago. It was remapped to the The Area homepage back in 2008 for the transition, it's lucky it still works at all. The Area's Softimage community URL is http://area.autodesk.com/products/view/softimage, as you can see by navigating the site..

I'm not aware of Mark's blog being decommissioned. is that true or speculation?

p.s.: double post! this site is jittery today

[Nizar]

@Nizar
Thanks for the link, & I agree it can be difficult to gage things,
but SI users tend to stick to it (for some reason) which gives makes me rather confident about it's current user base,
but it's newcomers that I'd like to see more of..

Yes, newcomers don't know at all softimage. Also softimage, for some strange reason, is out of the AD student free license marketing campaign. And another worse aspect is around the net a common idea about softimage:
softimage is something like a death software or axe in a near future.

I will love to see your site, but I think the basic is well explored and explained in many tutorials (commercial or free). What lack is something for intermediate or advanced users, something around a cool project showing softimage in all his glory

Also, Moghok (don't remember his nick...) the new AD employer for the Suite development, start a new blog into AREA, seems a nice guy, I think you can ask to him some info.

[Letterbox]

Autodesk still haven't found a Web Software Developer for the area. So apply for it, then surreptitiously load the whole site with SI related content

[FXDude]

@ luceric
yes I am well aware of the Area's *active* SI ..uhm.. area.

And I admit & agree that I should have mentioned it to be fair.

EDIT: it's there now.

Yet I was referencing that page, while making a parallel with the former community site (+all content) being taken down .. to XSIBase going down.. as it was what showed-up whenever following any of the numerous links around linking to it..

Otherwise I may very well be the author of my own misery, if not on this topic,
then at least on a few other fronts ; )


EDIT:
@ luceric

1st, My apologies, ..
for Marking Mark's blog as "decomissioned" on my screenshot (removed that bit)

I only went back there once quite a bit after the shufflings, and there was nothing after his "Crowd goes wild " post,
so I was really under the impression that he, just as Chinny, (essentially being the main SI "Mascots")
were no longer with SI (except probably in his heart)
especially by looking at his last post about his "Volkswagen Bus Cross Country" while taking the shot.

(still not sure though.. but reading through his quite good "all-sorts-of-good-stuff"
did give the impression that he's still around)

http://area.autodesk.com/blogs/marks/al ... good-stuff



and 2nd,
just to say, to get to that generic landing page, I didn't at-all type-in the address ,

I actually googled "softimage community"
and followed the foremost Area link named "Area :: Homepage - Softimage"
(the actual page is a few links down.. goes to show how many people clicked on links for it to be way up there)



You said "lucky it still works", but I'd would say
IT WOULD REALLY BE MORE THAT TIME NOW TO *TAKE IT DOWN*.. or REDIRECT to the real page.
now more than ever.. actually having a higher ranking than the actual page!

Wiping everything clean is one thing ..
but WHY not re-pointing to the new community site from the very start is *beyond me* ..
(directed at AD I guess (sigh) not LucEric : )

man...

..

[SreckoM]

p.s.: double post! this site is jittery today

Ha and I thought it was my precious Wacom.

I think this story is told so many times that it is starting to look like echo. Recently on local cg forum, mostly 3dsMax users, thread pops out named - 'SI dead, what is going on with that app?'. I was like WTF, but many of them thought that it is dead project, that SI does not exist anymore. And what is worse that users that entered cg industry in last 2 years never heard about it. But Modo on other hand is widely known. So current situation with SI is really complex. It is impossible with this level of marketing to familiarize new users with SI and what it is capable of. Obviously it is up to existing users to take that burden of keeping SI live and spreading that SI love

[FXDude]

@SreckoM
Good to know about your wacom..

I think this story would/will stay quite current.. either t'il SI would finally kick the bucket..
(due to excessive care, forthright-ness & over-consideration, )

(at which point I'm sure some people would find things to be soo much simpler.. & to which I would beg to differ..)

OR

when it gets.. not HUGE pointless ads .... but at least be remotely seen as an actual solution worth considering from the mothership itself.. (which would show whenever they would mention it),
or less be seen as a threat anymore.

(which doesn't cost anything apart for -some- efforts for -some- change of mind(-set))

..
OR Maybe it would come somewhere in between.. just as DS did..
(which would be like history repeating itself all over again)

I think it's far from impossible to avoid just that.. and not merely *exist* ..
(but -reasonably- flourish -while- co-existing.. eager to see the v2014 for that)

SI is not the first thing to be bought by competitors,
it's even been an exponentially growing trend since the dawn of the industrial age....
(not that this fact should at-all be comforting to say the least.. for quite a few OT reasons)

But some "acquirers" do seem have more consideration than others in respects to their absorbed counterparts.
and not just do like Lions (or other predators exclusively out for themselves) do in the *wild* jungle.

And not necessarily just so they don't look too bad..

aanyways..
(.sigh..)



@Nizar about tutorials..

What lack is something for intermediate or advanced users, something around a cool project showing softimage in all his glory

Also, Moghok (don't remember his nick...) the new AD employer for the Suite development, start a new blog into AREA, seems a nice guy, I think you can ask to him some info.

Okay I'll definatly look into it
( and think-up something for this cool project/tutorial thing.. will post preliminaries here : ) ..

(EDIT: typo)

[Nizar]

If I can help send me a PM

[FXDude]

Definitely!! : )