the future? (was: the "frustration" thread)

[Kerro Perro]

Well thank you Steve! Finally a straight answer

After the interview i did have a browse through the terms & conditions and it seemed that way: "Stand-alone (Individual) License is for a perpetual term, except as otherwise provided in this Agreement" only the lack of any hard answers and the second half of that line got me worried. I tried to digest the whole document to see what "otherwise was provided" but it was too legalese. I even showed it to a lawyer friend who said : "that line is still no garantee - american service contracts are notoriously skewed in the providers favor". Now he might've just been cynical - i don't know...

Well all in all i might've just been too paranoid but i do think it's telling of the way users currently feel under AD's wing: they don't feel safe.

I do think that is something caused by the bigwigs and not guys like you, when i mentioned AD employees being helpfull i was specifically thinking of you!

@ Hirazi: i did read somewhere just a few days ago that after some prodding an AD employee helped a user install his XSI 7 again - but i can't quite remember where i read or if it was here or xsibase... I too hope you're mistaken...

[xsisupport]

Just double-checked my subs invoice against last year - unit price of £775 per seat compared to £460 (plus tax of course). That's f***ing ridiculous. 70% increase??!!! I had 2 seats (for my fledgling company) and now will just have one on subscription. And thinking hard about that. Thanks for not providing a silver subscription Autodesk.

Almost all of this price increase came last year, when the price of Softimage Gold support was adjusted to be on the same level as Gold Support for Maya/Max and other products. Prior to that, Softimage Gold support in Europe was priced at much lower level. In the rest of the world, Softimage Gold support was already priced the same as the Gold support for other products.

The recent (27 March) Subscription price changed the UK GBP price from 775 to 785.

[xsisupport]

If your Subscription expires, you still have your license and it is a permanent license, and you can continue to use the most recent version you obtained under Subscription. You don't have to pay extra to keep using it.

But (please tell me I'm mistaken ) won't Autodesk at a certain point in the future stop issuing licenses for that year's version of the software (like they did a while back for the old xsi licenses, for instance), making it nearly impossible to install it on new hardware at a later date? Oh, I so hope I am mistaken...
;)

No, Autodesk won't stop issuing licenses.

Unless, of course, Autodesk is acquired or otherwise goes out of business (like Softimage). Then maybe you might end up in a situation where you cannot reactivate your license.

[Hirazi Blue]

So version retirement doesn't mean the end of licensing for that version?
That's great news!!!
I always assumed retirement and the end of technical support
automatically meant the end of license reissue also,
but this obviously only applied to the old xsi licenses...
(like i said: I'm glad to be proven wrong in this case...)

[xsisupport]

Well thank you Steve! Finally a straight answer

After the interview i did have a browse through the terms & conditions and it seemed that way: "Stand-alone (Individual) License is for a perpetual term, except as otherwise provided in this Agreement" only the lack of any hard answers and the second half of that line got me worried. I tried to digest the whole document to see what "otherwise was provided" but it was too legalese. I even showed it to a lawyer friend who said : "that line is still no garantee - american service contracts are notoriously skewed in the providers favor". Now he might've just been cynical - i don't know...

Well all in all i might've just been too paranoid but i do think it's telling of the way users currently feel under AD's wing: they don't feel safe.

I do think that is something caused by the bigwigs and not guys like you, when i mentioned AD employees being helpfull i was specifically thinking of you!

@ Hirazi: i did read somewhere just a few days ago that after some prodding an AD employee helped a user install his XSI 7 again - but i can't quite remember where i read or if it was here or xsibase... I too hope you're mistaken...

A couple of possible "otherwise" conditions:
A standalone license provided for evaluation purposes would not be perpetual. A standalone license with a fixed term is not perpetual.

[Kerro Perro]

Well thank you Steve! Finally a straight answer

After the interview i did have a browse through the terms & conditions and it seemed that way: "Stand-alone (Individual) License is for a perpetual term, except as otherwise provided in this Agreement" only the lack of any hard answers and the second half of that line got me worried. I tried to digest the whole document to see what "otherwise was provided" but it was too legalese. I even showed it to a lawyer friend who said : "that line is still no garantee - american service contracts are notoriously skewed in the providers favor". Now he might've just been cynical - i don't know...

Well all in all i might've just been too paranoid but i do think it's telling of the way users currently feel under AD's wing: they don't feel safe.

I do think that is something caused by the bigwigs and not guys like you, when i mentioned AD employees being helpfull i was specifically thinking of you!

@ Hirazi: i did read somewhere just a few days ago that after some prodding an AD employee helped a user install his XSI 7 again - but i can't quite remember where i read or if it was here or xsibase... I too hope you're mistaken...

A couple of possible "otherwise" conditions:
A standalone license provided for evaluation purposes would not be perpetual. A standalone license with a fixed term is not perpetual.

Well my license is not for evaluation - would be a rather pricey evaluation - but where can i check if it's a fixed term? In the subscription center i can only find info on my sub contract. I'm fairly sure i can check it by re-installing and reading the EULA but is there an easier way?

I just really want to put this to bed so i can just get on with creating art instead of ranting on forums ;)

[xsisupport]

Well thank you Steve! Finally a straight answer

After the interview i did have a browse through the terms & conditions and it seemed that way: "Stand-alone (Individual) License is for a perpetual term, except as otherwise provided in this Agreement" only the lack of any hard answers and the second half of that line got me worried. I tried to digest the whole document to see what "otherwise was provided" but it was too legalese. I even showed it to a lawyer friend who said : "that line is still no garantee - american service contracts are notoriously skewed in the providers favor". Now he might've just been cynical - i don't know...

Well all in all i might've just been too paranoid but i do think it's telling of the way users currently feel under AD's wing: they don't feel safe.

I do think that is something caused by the bigwigs and not guys like you, when i mentioned AD employees being helpfull i was specifically thinking of you!

@ Hirazi: i did read somewhere just a few days ago that after some prodding an AD employee helped a user install his XSI 7 again - but i can't quite remember where i read or if it was here or xsibase... I too hope you're mistaken...

A couple of possible "otherwise" conditions:
A standalone license provided for evaluation purposes would not be perpetual. A standalone license with a fixed term is not perpetual.

Well my license is not for evaluation - would be a rather pricey evaluation - but where can i check if it's a fixed term? In the subscription center i can only find info on my sub contract. I'm fairly sure i can check it by re-installing and reading the EULA but is there an easier way?

I just really want to put this to bed so i can just get on with creating art instead of ranting on forums ;)

If you have a network license, it will say "permanent" in the actual license file.
OR you could look at Help > About Sotimage > Product License Information.
Or you can PM me your serial number or account info and I will look it up.

[Kerro Perro]

Steve you're the best

I checked the product license information:

pit.PNG

That has put me at ease, i'm now going to do this about any other AD panics:

In fact i'm off to go see the Avengers! Have a good weekend guys!

[Rez007]

Thanks Steve, that actually cleared up a lot for me as well.

I do have a question though that most likely wont be answered due to AD internal reasons, but it is actually steming from something Luceric mentioned about why there is no Silver Sub for Softimage. (I think he was referring that if a cheaper solution was offered, and since most users of Softimage are on subscription, that most of us might convert to the Silver Sub, essentially, cutting the development budget/income drastically for Softimage - which would be a mighty blow given our smaller user size.) So, with that, is that basically saying that our Subscription goes directly to Softimage Development and the people involved with everything Softimage? Or is it done differently? I just want to make sure that the money we spend goes to Softimage and help keeping it going rather than that money slipping over to other DCC content and solutions that don't directly affect me. In addition, if I were to ever jump over to a Suite, I would then be classified as, lets say, a 3Ds Max Creation Suite owner and no longer just a Softimage owner. So, with that scenario does the subscription money get split amongst the packages in that Suite, or would it go to mainly 3Ds Max developemnt (which I definitely wouldn't want to happen), or is there another possiblity where you guys track to see what software I use mostly in that Suite and allocate the funds to that product? I am not in paranoia here, but I think you can see where I am going with this...if we, Softimage users, were to migrate to the Suites for only $200 more a year, would that inevitably mean less funding going to Softimage?

[xsisupport]

Thanks Steve, that actually cleared up a lot for me as well.

I do have a question though that most likely wont be answered due to AD internal reasons, but it is actually steming from something Luceric mentioned about why there is no Silver Sub for Softimage. (I think he was referring that if a cheaper solution was offered, and since most users of Softimage are on subscription, that most of us might convert to the Silver Sub, essentially, cutting the development budget/income drastically for Softimage - which would be a mighty blow given our smaller user size.) So, with that, is that basically saying that our Subscription goes directly to Softimage Development and the people involved with everything Softimage? Or is it done differently? I just want to make sure that the money we spend goes to Softimage and help keeping it going rather than that money slipping over to other DCC content and solutions that don't directly affect me. In addition, if I were to ever jump over to a Suite, I would then be classified as, lets say, a 3Ds Max Creation Suite owner and no longer just a Softimage owner. So, with that scenario does the subscription money get split amongst the packages in that Suite, or would it go to mainly 3Ds Max developemnt (which I definitely wouldn't want to happen), or is there another possiblity where you guys track to see what software I use mostly in that Suite and allocate the funds to that product? I am not in paranoia here, but I think you can see where I am going with this...if we, Softimage users, were to migrate to the Suites for only $200 more a year, would that inevitably mean less funding going to Softimage?

Sorry, I don't know how revenue translates into budget/funding for different groups or products.

But I don't think anybody on any product team wants to see their revenue numbers go down. Whether or not it impacts future funding, you want to see your product generating revenue.

[j3st3r]

I'm scared of the future of Softimage. And since my company is on subscription, and I am a frequenter on Technical Support request site, I think I (the company) have the right to ask Autodesk what's their roadmap with Softimage. We pay yearly fee to receive the updates. It is an investment, and we want our investment on the right place. I think the biggest problem is that Autodesk became the exclusive owner of the three major 3D applications, and have the slightest interest what the users really want.

Softimage is not perfect, but to me, it's the closest to be perfect. I want bugfixes, improvements for my (company) money, and clear plan for the next few years. That's fair request isn't it?

[Nizar]

I'm scared of the future of Softimage. And since my company is on subscription, and I am a frequenter on Technical Support request site, I think I (the company) have the right to ask Autodesk what's their roadmap with Softimage. We pay yearly fee to receive the updates. It is an investment, and we want our investment on the right place. I think the biggest problem is that Autodesk became the exclusive owner of the three major 3D applications, and have the slightest interest what the users really want.

Softimage is not perfect, but to me, it's the closest to be perfect. I want bugfixes, improvements for my (company) money, and clear plan for the next few years. That's fair request isn't it?

Bellsey said due to USA law an LtD company, like AD, cannot mention about future plans...

I was here before AD acquisition, so don't know the Avid time. Avid did clear future plan? Advised customers about ICE (I remember code name was Moon Dust)?

[Kerro Perro]

I'm scared of the future of Softimage. And since my company is on subscription, and I am a frequenter on Technical Support request site, I think I (the company) have the right to ask Autodesk what's their roadmap with Softimage. We pay yearly fee to receive the updates. It is an investment, and we want our investment on the right place. I think the biggest problem is that Autodesk became the exclusive owner of the three major 3D applications, and have the slightest interest what the users really want.

Softimage is not perfect, but to me, it's the closest to be perfect. I want bugfixes, improvements for my (company) money, and clear plan for the next few years. That's fair request isn't it?

Bellsey said due to USA law an LtD company, like AD, cannot mention about future plans...

I was here before AD acquisition, so don't know the Avid time. Avid did clear future plan? Advised customers about ICE (I remember code name was Moon Dust)?

Not quite right - the fact is that he and other employees aren't allowed to share plans on limited platforms such as these > the information shared might lead to "insider trading" with knowledge that is not "publicly" known (and this is already a bit of a stretch... ) But Autodesk could make any public announcement about future plans they want as long as it's through "proper channels" i.e. mainstream media.

I'm not going to speculate as to why they don't but the point is that could if they really wanted to.

Btw Avengers was awesome go see it!

[Hirazi Blue]

Unless I am very much mistaken, Avid nor Softimage (the company) divulged their long-time roadmap. But, this was back in the day, when everybody naively assumed Softimage (the company) was to "live forever" (and I was never on the side of the bigger clients, obviously, who may have been told more than the mere foot soldiers).

The best indication of where Softimage is heading as far as "public" statements go, seems to have come from Luc-Eric Rousseau on this forum a while back:

Softimage has a full development team in place, and plans for the future. But let's not look at the market with rose-colored glasses and pretend Softimage is on equal footing with the other two, that people just see a demo of it to see the light, and can switch anytime.

(Quoted from here)

But he concluded that post with:

Best case, I think, Softimage will retain about the same position it has now. It may hinge on whether Maya or Max would get a ICE equivalent and if there are things you can only do in Softimage.

(Quoted from here again)

Luc-Eric wrote all this on 11th of March 2012, about a month before he himself announced to have joined the Maya development team (presumably to show them how to do some of the stuff you now "can only do in Softimage").

[Nizar]

Kerro Perro@ my fault (must study english with greater fervour

But in any case they don't say nothing about 3dsm and Maya as softimage, so is the some.

Softimage has a full development team in place, and plans for the future. But let's not look at the market with rose-colored glasses and pretend Softimage is on equal footing with the other two, that people just see a demo of it to see the light, and can switch anytime.

Don't perfectly understood: he mean softimage have not the some market share of 3dsm and Maya, but the other users (from maya and 3dsm) can switch when see XSI demo/trial? Or don't delude ourself, this never happen?

And, other statement, softimage will maintain the actual (subordination?) position only if maintains some particular characteristics like ICE? So a Maya Ice (mICE) will be the end of the story?

OT: "We'll always have Paris"
Do you mean Hilton? Paris Hilton using or is a softimage developer?!?

[Hirazi Blue]

Ah, Nizar, the "lack" of American cultural reference: "We'll always have Paris!" is a world-famous movie quote from the classic movie Casablanca. (According to Wikipedia it apparently was 43rd on AFI's 100 Years...100 Movie Quotes)
You'll have to see it (in its original) to understand what I mean by my signature, I guess (but IMHO it's well worth it)
;)