exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

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angelous4x
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exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by angelous4x » 13 Aug 2015, 05:18

I was never a programmer, partly because i am dyslexic. so looking though lines of code to look for a miss placed comma is alittle hard for me. after a while i see flowers and butterflies and realize i am looking out the window.

but using ice i never had to go through lines of code, a crazy ice tree sure. but never had to script. while doing some tuts for houdini, i got to randomize some particles, size, rot, scale i have to script every line all the time.

it might be to sideFx benefit to make the (Houdini) system a little more artiest friendly. exposing all the data(scalar, integer etc.)
and just focusing on the math. just like in ice.

thoughts?

nodeway

Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by nodeway » 13 Aug 2015, 05:36

Upload example scene in which you had to script so much.

angelous4x
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Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by angelous4x » 13 Aug 2015, 05:54

it was just some tutorial, just never had to do it for any kind of particle effects i did in soft.

nodeway

Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by nodeway » 13 Aug 2015, 06:05

I got couple tools where I prefer to use Python to manage group creation because I felt that it was easier for me. I also prefer to write VEX version of some deformer/modifier instead of VOP. I have DigitalAsset versions of my tools, but I wrote C++ versions of couple of them, because I prefer it that way.

If you are a Houdini guy with 3> years of experience, chances are big that you will prefer to do it this way. For new people that's opposite. Post your problem for others to see, because maybe you could do it easily without code, but the guys from tutorial just prefers code way of solving problem, instead of node way.

With that said, you will not run away from expressions.

angelous4x
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Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by angelous4x » 13 Aug 2015, 17:06

guess i am spoiled with xsi. where i could do something so simple as pressing tab and getting a randomize node. and pluging it in.
guess i can't avoid expressions.

angelous4x
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Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by angelous4x » 15 Aug 2015, 20:25

it still should be looked into, a more artist friendly Houdini. I am sure then more artist will come over and not walk away as soon as they see the modeling tools.

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Hirazi Blue
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Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by Hirazi Blue » 15 Aug 2015, 21:52

If Houdini ever became a true well-rounded user-friendly generalist application,
Autodesk would have to resurrect Softimage to really attempt to compete.
So yes, please!
=;

fanboy speaking, not realistic obviously
Stay safe, sane & healthy!

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Mathaeus
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Re: exposing data in houdini like in ICE (no scripting)

Post by Mathaeus » 16 Aug 2015, 16:17

angelous4x wrote:guess i am spoiled with xsi. where i could do something so simple as pressing tab and getting a randomize node. and pluging it in.
guess i can't avoid expressions.
Well as a matter of fact, exactly this one is possible :). There's 'randomize attribute' node in H 14. But ( but.....) it works in bit different way. Let's try to explain it visually: H way is close to "A" in attached pic. Not the same, anyway, you have to type the exact name of parameter/attribute you want to change. If this is something specific to operator, like "targetedgelength" or something, you need to take look at docs, to see which parameter is allowed to be modified, or, is it allowed at all.

For something like "B" or "C" in pic, perhaps is still possible to do blends, somehow, using 'composite attribute" or something. Or, by re - building the functionality in new node, in similar way someone will do in ICE.

Long story short, "plug this into that, just to see what happens", as an method of creation, this is far widely possible in ICE. I have to admit, I've used this method too, in ICE. Found it especially good for quick tests of public available stuff I made.

'True well-rounded user-friendly app' I think this will take a while. There's a sort of chicken egg problem, no enough of artists with artist's demands, from user's side. On Side Effects side, it seems that 'user friendly' is perceived as more of shelf tools, some small enhance here and there. But not any structural change. Shelf Tool = creates setup via scripted procedure, which is nice to see what it is going, but - once you're in trouble or you want to modify something, it became even more hard, full of 'general purpose' nodes, not actually needed for particular setup.

Finally, when it comes to 'direct' tools, sort of lost criteria. It seems that someone at Side Effects has cojones to play with standards, but don't care to explain how you'll be able to get some ordinary (in other apps) effect with this. For example, unseen behavior of rotation manipulator, to hide some axis by angle to camera, so full rotation became possible only with alternative, MMB method, which one does not respect the gimbal mode. In practice, I have to constantly rotate the viewport, just to catch the damn rotation manipulator. And so on and so on. When it comes to direct animation tools, if anyone else will have the H solutions, people will be talking about incompetency or general problems of company - but, because it is, well, Houdini, must be something great behind, only it is not visible to mortals, right now. While almost nobody takes care to depict with complex example or user case, what on the earth is so great.

To be fair, I think H procedural modeling is still fairly easier than ICE topo. But, H has no some of general SI standard ops, like SI quadrangulate, all the variances of SI smooth and relax, SI bevel has far more of usable options. So, I think any improvement in modeling field is good idea, for Houdini. Ironically, exactly SI quadrangulate helped me to got better render times in H Mantra, sometimes.

When it comes to vectors matrices and such, has a bit more of user friendly (well, in this category.... ) nodes, some of them belongs to "vector math pornography" :) for my taste, things like recreating the local transform, pivots and so.


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