I meant the author of the compound/addon, so he would be able to edit his own entries. That would be a huge effort because there also must be a way for the author to "claim" his user account in case he didn't make one yet. Also sometimes it's more than one person.

Did you btw want to create a repository for ICE compunds only, or also for addons/shaders/tools etc.? If it would be for compounds only, I think something like a "web compound manager" plugin could be cool, with no web interface at all, but with the ability to upload/edit/search&view compounds from a UI inside Softimage. They could be indivdually activated/deactivated and would appear right away in the compounds list. I think this is something that might have the chance to start from an empty repository.

@HB -- good point about the commenting, for most addons a thread also already exists somewhere. I think avoiding the in-app-upload spamming could be done partly automatically by some sort of versioning/update functionality, but this would again be adding to the complexity.

I havnt built anything to any level of complexity my friend is the Chairman of this company http://www.lshift.net/ who have built some extremely complicated stuff! and they even have coded some open source web tools called 'Icing' so serendipitous for our ICE compounds storage dilemma! Perhaps what they do is somewhat overkill for our needs but anyway will see what they have to advise about proceeding with this.

Ah I see. well isnt this just a matter of having an entry for the name of the compound uploader and also the author name if its different. If the original author wants to connect or to edit compound details that they have made but someone else has uploaded - once they have an account then the original uploader or moderator can redirect the author name to the proper account name or pass ownership of edits back to them or just delete their entry and allow the author to upload the compound again. if that makes sense. and not sure its going to be a problem, its such a small community in Softimage niche land that I really dont see this as being much of an issue.

Same as double entries. our immediate problem is the amount of sharing entries shrinking per month rather than there being too many and doubling up!

regarding whether it should be ICE compounds and / or Materials / Plugins / Scripts well for simplicity sakes it might be best to stick to just ICE compounds for now , although my original rant still stands, nobody is sharing materials either and it may be a good incentive to try and reignite the sharing philosophy again with this initiative but am concerned about biting off more than we can chew

Also if we made something that worked from inside softimage as a plugin sort of like SIBL? http://www.hdrlabs.com/sibl/software.html , really cool concept rray - would we not need a separate plugin for every single version of Softimage? this seems like even more hassle on top , but again Ive never authored a plugin either

I would sincerely hope not: some kind of minimal web interface (even with less functionality) would be nice/necessary for the dying breed of users who run an offline workstation (like me). A built-in functionality to generate Netview-friendly webpages, however, usable from with Softimage's own limited webbrowser, like the XSIBase has been doing for years, might be an friendlier option to all...


Limiting the initiative to ICE compounds might be look easier, I however would strongly advise against it. If you want to establish the one-and-only new download hub, it should cover all possible content. Otherwise you wouldn't be able to unify the upload/download "business" as similar sites would/could/should still have to be established/maintained to cover all the bases and therefore it would make the effort quite pointless, if I may be so blunt, and would make the effort to be accepted as the "place to be" all the more complicated...

(I moved this post ever so slightly)

Ah ok I was in the context of migrating rray.de to a db. Starting from an empty database this is not a big issue since it only happen as an exception.

I don't see yet why one "web compound manager" plugin wouldn't work for several versions of Softimage, but you're right - too much effort for what is rather a luxury item. More even considering there would have to be an offline version as well for HB

(btw hacked some basic upload function to rray.de .. hope it works )

So chiming in here rather late as I've been on vacation for the last few weeks.

Some words of wisdom / warning. Creating a new site run by 1-2 people that doesn't return a significant monetry amount will surely lead to the sites failure. I'm talking from experience. That is mainly why XSIDatabase is more or less dead. I dont' have the time and don't have a good return for the work I put in to the site. Personally it was never utilized enough by the user base to justify putting more work into it. Whatever that reason was / is. My advice for anyone wanting to extend one of the community sites or create a new one is to not do it unless the above criteria is attained. Otherwise the work / reward will not suffice enough for a continued effort.

It's really sad that the AREA is in the state it is. Whether it is getting better or not is insignificant as it is unusable in its current state (see past comments, no need to rehash) and even if it is getting better it's moving at nearly a negative snails pace from the users perspective. AD is missing a huge opportunity to benefit ALL of the M&E customers by having a usable resource site for its products. Softimage, Maya, Max, etc. I'm talking for all.

If any effort is being made I'd hope that those who are moving forward with it also keep the system as SIMPLE as possible. Nothing fancy. Keep things simple so that it can be easily maintained. We have all seen what happens to resources that are customized immensely (XSIBase). They fall into ruin as the base software is upgraded and patched where the themes and customizations become too numerous to keep up.

If anyone is thinking of creating a custom login system to allow users to upload resources keep a few things in mind. You become responsible for keeping their data protected. You're also in a position where if there is anything that can cause damage (infected files uploaded to the site) you can become somewhat responsible.

A final issue of these sites that you'll have to battle is users uploading others files. I wouldn't want just anyone uploading my addons / plugins without my concent. Some have voiced their concerns over RRay.de/xsi over the years. I have no problem as most of my stuff is uploaded but also linked. Which brings up another issue where some users want to be able to enter a URL and NOT upload a file. Make sure to consider that.

Hopefully the above gives anyone wishing to enter these waters with something useful. I am not sure what the future of XSIDatabase will be but I may end up taking it down within the next year as I dont' believe its useful any more.

I agree with this 100%.... very well said!

Cheers,

Joe

While you both agree (Joe and Eric) on the Area being upgraded, from a users perspective it makes sense.

I post this so hopefully you'll understand some of the recent events and give you a unemotional business perspective on the issue.

I'd like to point out that from Autodesk's or any Business's perspective it does not make sense to upgrade it (even though they are looking for a web developer) or even have the Area at all.

Because it basically does not maximize business profits, simply put the Area costs money for it to exist. In business terms the Area is a cost center.

Clearly what Autodesk should be doing is externalizing the cost, by allowing and supporting (approved) 3rd parties to create a si/max/maya etc forums. Where they off load the costs and staffing and any negative consequences (as mentioned above post). This is a typical modern business practice. And given the current restructuring I see no good reason why it has not happened.

As well as externalizing the cost, the development, the maintenance, they also externalize the constant complaints that they cant even manage a web site, and the negative impact contained therein. Of course through advertising one can leverage and influence what moderators allow, in terms of users voicing their, lets say, 'unfettered opinions'.

You might not like this concept, its not mentioned for you to like or no, it's mentioned because its a proven way to realize profits, manage perception, and externalize costly responsibility. And given the route Autodesk is following it would only make sense to completely invest in externalization all aspects of it's business. It's surprising that Mr Bass has not extended his fiduciary responsibility to the shareholders by extending cost externalization of this clear and apparent cost center to its fullest and most logical extent.

I understand you might not agree with this, but that is irrelevant, this is business survival, and with all the new tools at siggraph the pressure is obviously increasing to maintain and grow profitability.

That’s important as one has to realize that the likes of Mr. Bass has a legal responsibility, not to the users, not to the staff, but is legally bound to solely be concerned for the shareholders above all else, which is reflected in the share dividend and stock price, you've just seen those forces in play.

As one someone nicely put, if you want loyalty get a dog, because its trench warfare out there, and the nice guy doesn't always win.

Regards
Steven

I fully understand the point you are making here.

That said, here is my opinion on the matter.

1. A 3rd party attempting to run such a site will almost certainly fail over the long-term.

2. While I agree it is a cost center... it's a drop in the bucket to AD bottom line and it's from my POV it's a worthwhile investment.

I don't expect anyone to agree with me... this is purely my opinion.

Cheers,

J

All this stuff and the "fiduciary responsibility" lecture is all b.s IMHO. M&E are the ones who created The Area in the first place. And they revised it already, what, three time? All the product launches are happening there, they want people subscribed and active there. It's all marketing, like 3December, user group and other things they don't "need" to do. Autodesk also doesn't need to spend millions sponsoring events like Siggraph. They recently created a mudbox web community. Autodesk is also launching App Store for various products and they have more in the pipeline.